Cham. Ah, the memories: Maurice smiling benignly at the antics of the drunken Brits in the Bar National, fusing the lights in the Alpenstock bar so the sausages hanging above the bar could be liberated, getting thrown off the old Biolay camp area by armed gendarmes, learning to aid climb on the East Face of the Grand Capucin, learning to ice climb on the Brenva Face of Mont Blanc, only just escaping rockfall and avalanches. Not everyone did.
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A complete tangent (that’s semi-relevant) - but a really interesting article today on the effects of rising temperatures on the world’s alpine regions (and associated glacier & rockfall conditions). Perhaps it’ll be March trips to the Alps in the future.
I’m easy on dates and location and will quietly lurk until decisions are made by others…!
Cham granite is covered in holds. From very small and positive to massive (and waiting to fall out/off on/onto you)
Like really good Scottish granite rather than the blobbier Cornish variety.
Matt Kingsley.
(m) 07900 246 256
(w) 07717 838 901
what precisely is wrong with gallivanting around Canada!? 
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Canadian rockies rock is covered in holds but they are often disposable ones? 
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I prefer to think of them as portable, that way you can keep your favourite hold with you
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Guy, are we any clearer on the dates yet? I know the venue is still in discussion.
Hi Rob - dates seem to be confirmed as 11-18th July as nobody objected.
I for one will be looking to extend for at least a week after. Although I may arrive late if (when) England are in the final of Euro 2012 on July 12.
Yes 11-18th it is.
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Date decided then, great!
I think for the destination decision, it depends on:
- Alpine or only rock
- Are you likely to have a car (rental or driving from UK)
- Could you see yourself paying 15-20euro per day for lifts.
If it is mainly alpinist goals with not too limited budget, then based on the past years, Chamonix is a more reliable option as the lifts help to access higher ground. Also if you are after trad granite cracks, Chamonix has more of those (peppered with inevitable slab pitches 
)
However, if there is a big number interested in easy access rock routes with very limited budget, then Ailefroide is more inclusive. In Chamonix there’s an affordable campsite in Argentiere and with your car you can reach a lot of the great places Rob mentioned earlier with 20-50min drive.
Huts cost about the same everywhere in France (except if you want to summit Mt Blanc). Tents cost nothing and just need to be mindful that Chx bivy spots are packed with climbing tourists so bring earplugs. 
I will be in the region of Vercors, Ceuse and Les Ecrins all June so if anyone is keen to get there early, I will be around and lacking climbing partners except for the occasional weekend.
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Similar plans for pregaming for the alpine meet. Would be tempted by some time in Ceuse or the Verdon
I could definitely come out earlier, maybe even 2nd/3rd.
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I am likely to spend a good chunk of May in Verdon! 
Hi everyone,
I’m going to suggest that that this years meet is in Chamonix from 11-18 July. I think that given we have been to the Ecrins as a club a number of times before and given that for an alpine meet Chamonix may be a more suitable venue it is worth giving it a go. There is, as many have pointed out, loads of excellent rock only climbing around too (and sport climbing 20-50 min drive away).
Sad I can’t go (but also not sad because I’ll be in Canada)! Matt and Paul have kindly agreed to do a joint organising job so will leave it to them to sort out campsites/accommodation etc.
Guy
Thanks Guy. I will research campsites today and post something on this in due course. As I haven’t been to Cham since 2015, people with more recent accommodation knowledge can feel free to PM me any suggestions.
I’ll be driving out to the Alps and will have 2 spare spaces in the car (maybe 3 spaces but I’ll check). I’ll be able to drop whomever takes these places in Cham. I’ll drive over on the Saturday morning early and arrive saturday evening. Drive back on the Sunday.
Just to be clear Rob- which actual dates?
I changed the thread title to reflect the established facts regarding date and venue.
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Ah, good shout. Thanks for pointing it out!
So, as promised, here’s your information overload…
Disclaimer
This is mainly for people who haven’t been before, old hands will doubtless know all this stuff. I am well aware that some people have been to Chamonix far more than me (and indeed lived there…thanks @Kris !) so if I have made any errors or there’s useful information you’d like to add, please PM me and I’ll edit the original post in an effort to avoid a huge string of replies.
Chamonix
The self-proclaimed ‘world capital of alpinism’ Chamonix sits in the narrow Arve valley just north of the Mont Blanc massif. Being a major centre for all kinds of Alpine tourism it has many options for supermarkets, climbing shops, bars and restaurants and almost every sort of amusement and debauchery is available if you don’t want to go climbing. The OHM office https://www.chamoniarde.com/# (NB on the website the English one does not have all the reports) can provide much useful information about weather and conditions (and you can photocopy any topos there for a small fee).
Bear in mind that most shops will close from 12-3 during lunch and all day on Sundays.
Argentière
Smaller town northeast of Chamonix which gives access to the Les Grands Montets ski lifts for the Argentière and Le Tour cable cars used for the eastern end of the range (e.g Glacier du Tour) and as well as most of the valley cragging and bouldering at Col des Montets.
Vallorcines is the main venue for valley cragging and sport multi-pitching, giving access to the eastern Aiguilles Rouges, Barberine and Le Cheserys areas as well as its eponymous crag and the bouldering at Col des Montets.
Courmayeur
The major base on the Italian side, reached via the Mont Blanc tunnel (drive or bus), Courmayeur is near to the Helbronner lift system in La Palud, which is mainly used to reach the Torino Hut.
Getting there
Flying
The quickest way is to fly to Geneva and then either hire a car and drive to Cham (1 hour), or catch a train (2-3 hours, can be expensive) or get a transfer like MountainDropOffs, AlpyBus, Ouibus or Easybus. Swissbus do a direct bus from Geneva Airport to Chamonix Sud - direct and €14.99. Runs about every 2 hours from the airport. You could also fly to Turin but this is a much longer drive and goes through the very expensive Mont Blanc Tunnel.
Train
London to Paris on the Eurostar (2-3 hours) then Paris to Chamonix (5-6 hours) usually including one change.
https://raileurope.co.uk/destinations/paris-chamonix-train
Driving
11-12 hours from London, using the ferry or Channel Tunnel (it’s 8 hours from Calais)
Peage costs about €80-90.
Staying there
As Rob has previously said, you should consider whether you want to mainly camp in the valley for cragging on the sport crags or the Aiguilles Rouges, or whether you want to get up high and use the huts. Huts are definitely the best option if you want to get serious alpinism done, as rising temperatures, glacial deterioration and the expense of uplift have made doing alpine routes from the valley floor both more dangerous and more expensive. While there’s no obligation to hang out together at the expense of your ambitions, it would be nice if we could largely be based at one campsite…
Campsites
Prices will usually have the Carte d’Hote cost added (see below) which is going to be between €0.20 and €0.60 per night per person. I will try and reserve space once we have a reasonable idea of numbers but not all of them take reservations.
Camping du Glacier d’Argentière
Location: Argentière, 80 places
Apparently quieter, larger and with more facilities, a few people have recommended this one. Due to the effects of the Grand Montets cable car fire, access to the mountains by lift at this end has been affected a bit but I still think we should go with this one.
Price per Person Price per tent Price per car Total Price per night
€ 6.70 € 3.40 € 6.10 €10.1/12.90
(These prices are subject to change as their tariff page is down so the chamonix.com site might not be up-to-date!)
Camping Les Arolles
Location: Chamonix (central)
I have used this one before. On the plus side it is in central Chamonix and within walking distance of various lifts and the Chamonix Sud train station for the valley railway. On the negative side it is small, crowded, has limited facilities and is right next to a dual carriageway!
Price per Person Price per tent Price per car Total Price per night
€ 7.10 € 4.40 € 6.10 €11.5/13.2
Other less central or suitable campsites can be found here: https://www.chamonix.com/camping-and-motorhome-area,117,en.html
Getting Around
If you are staying in the valley you can use a Carte d’Hote (Guest Card) which gives you free travel on the trains and buses in the valley. It should given to you on your arrival by your campsite or gite manager.
Trains
There is a local rail service that runs the length of the valley from St Gervais to Vallorcine and on into Switzerland, with stops in all major towns (in Chamonix and Argentière there are stations close to all the major lift stations) https://www.mont-blanc-express.ch/nos-horaires/
Buses
Local bus services run throughout the valley, timetables at: https://chamonix.montblancbus.com/fr/ligne-de-bus or at the tourist information centre.
Non-exhaustive list of lifts and prices (which may have gone up by July)
Lift status can be accessed from here
You can either get a multi day pass or purchase return tickets if you are staying in huts. The main ticket office in Montenvers station can advise you on which one is likely to be better deal for your needs. Most lifts offer a discounted climbing price for certain return trips.
Aiguille du Midi - €50 one way, €52 return
Plan de l’Aiguille - €17.50 one way, €33.50 return
Downtown Chamonix, this very expensive two-stage lift drops you on the spectacular Midi top station for access to the Cosmiques Refuge and a huge range of objectives on the Aiguilles, Tacul and Vallée Blanche areas. You can get off halfway at the Plan d l’Aiguille for many of the Chamonix Aiguilles routes.
Panoramique - €27 return
Runs across the Vallée Blanche from the Midi to the Helbronner, so you can get to and from the Italian side and the Torino Hut.
Grands Montets/Lognan/Joran - €25.50 mountaineering ticket
Main lift station in Argentière giving access to the Argentière Glacier. Unfortunately the Lognan mid-station caught fire last year and has not been reopened!
Le Tour - €26.50 mountaineering ticket
The Charamillon cable car and Autannes ski lift run from here, allowing you to seriously reduce the walk to the Albert Premier Hut and access the Tour and Trient Glaciers.
Brévent/Planpraz - €26 mountaineering ticket
Based in Chamonix the Brévent and Planpraz lifts get you up to the single and multipitch rock routes on the south/western end of the Aiguilles Rouges.
Index/Flégère - €26.50 mountaineering ticket
From the suburb of Les Praz you can catch the Flégère lift and Index ski lift to the central and northeastern sections of the Aiguilles Rouges.
Montenvers (mountain railway) - €31 return, 8am-6:30pm
Scenic mountain railway departing from the northern end of Chamonix which gives you access via a dodgy ladder system to the Mer de Glace and thence the Envers Des Aiguilles and Talèfre Glaciers.
Tramway du Mont Blanc - €31 return
Mountain railway running from St Gervais on the west side of Mont Blanc allowing access to the Bionassay Glacier.
Huts
There are at least 20 staffed huts in the Mont Blanc range (and numerous unstaffed bivvy shelters and no I’m not listing them all!) the vast majority of which are French (mostly run by the Federation Francaise des Clubs Alpins et de Montagne (FFCAM) and will cost around €20-€30 for a bed and up to €60 for half board (bed + breakfast and dinner, which is compulsory in some huts and most will insist you cook outside well away from the hut if you have brought your own food). Book in advance (some, like the notorious Gouter, have to be booked well in advance) and take cash.
https://www.chamonet.com/huts/
List of more recent guidebooks (* = I’ve got this one)
Chamonix Rockfax (2016)*
The 4000m Peaks of the Alps, Martin Moran/Alpine Club (2007)*
Snow, Ice and Mixed Vol.1, Francois Damilano (2005)
Snow, Ice and Mixed Vol.2, Francois Damilano (2006)
Crag Climbs in Chamonix, Francois Burnier/Dominique Potard (2015)*
Eau Noire - The Aiguilles Rouges 2, Michel Piola (2016)
Les Aiguilles Rouges Vol 1, Michel Piola (2008)*
Les Aiguilles Rouges Vol 2, Michel Piola (2012)
Mont Blanc Granite - Volume 1: Argentière Basin, JMEditions (2016)
Mont Blanc Granite - Volume 2: The Chamonix Aiguilles, JMEditions (2017)
Schweiz Plaisir West Band 2 (2019)
Escalades: Jura, Vaud, Chablais, Bas-Valais, Sanetsch (2019)
https://www.camptocamp.org/topoguide is a French wiki topo thingy, thanks Kris!
Mountain Rescue…it’s not free in Europe!
Getting rescued by helicopter (and worse, getting taken to any hospital but especially a Swiss hospital) can be mind-blowingly expensive unless you are insured. BMC or Austrian Alpine Club insurance is well worth having (currently the BMC are offering 15% discount!).
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